FREDDIE

Interview "LAN_002_anon"

Please navigate the recording by using the player on top or clicking in the transcription.

Enable/disable auto-scroll as required.

Use an up-to-date browser for best results.

Transcript

´╗┐speakerAwell ehm I'm eighty-three love so it'd be eighteen
interviewerninety-two were you a big family
speakerAyes 't was ehm four girls and three boys ((is it on))
interviewerand were you were you the oldest
speakerAeh I was the second
speakerBno
speakerAI'm the second oldest and there were very hard
speakerB{NS}
interviewerit's alright go on
speakerA((it were))
speakerB{NS}
speakerAyes but {NS} went down in the war
speakerBoh well it don't matter
speakerAyeah {NS} was the ((oldest)) he went down in the war and then there was eh me sister {NS} and then there was me and eh there was {NS} the others were born from eh where we'd eh (()) where we (()) shifted from of course they were very hard times then
interviewerwhat did your dad do what was his job
speakerAeh me dad do we we kept {NS} cottage on ironworks road and dad was like ehm the caretakers and mum eh used to have to do the office and eh us girls had to go down and dust the office after we come home from school and we had house rent ((firin')) and lights free but eh we were had to look for dad had to look about the ground and see to the works you see I hadn't got to be off the ground
interviewermh
speakerAand he had to open up you see for the workmen comin' in at six in the mornin'
interviewermh
speakerAit was very lonely
interviewerI bet it was
speakerAit it was on ironworks road under the tunnel
interviewerwhat kind of works was it
speakerAehm don- +don't they just eh eh used to run waggons in that's all I could (()) remember you know I was only little used to run eh the waggons in and eh used to eh ((we'd)) the boiler and father used to have to put about fifty shovels of coal on every night and get steam up ready for mornin' and if dad was eh goin' out anywhere he used to put a bit of wha- +what ehm waste round the gauge glass and eh he used to say to me now when you go down the works go and see if the steam's up to this piece of waste and if it is turn the steam off and then go up the ladder and pull the damper down and when I pulled the damper down I was as black as the grate I used to have to go in the baths because took the steam off from the works see and it had to be on warm for the men goin' in in the mornin' ((we were)) very lonely there was no shops we used to half to come nearly half a mile if we wanted even a packet of salt
interviewer'cause it's quite a long way up there isn't it
speakerAit's a long way right down you know near the ehm the bridge the foot bridge the bridge as you're goin' to Walney and we were at the top where the tunnel was
intervieweris it still there or has it gone now
speakerAoh it's gone now it's all down now and the cottage is all down and the works all down so then we left there and we came up into Hindpool and eh {NS} was born in Hindpool {NS} was born in Hindpool and me brother was born in Hindpool and then there came eh a slum- +slump and eh all the works was out there was no dole no nothing ((you know)) father had to do the go anyway to try and get a a few shillin's
interviewerwhat job did he do when he left {NS}
speakerAehm he went to the gas works he was a gas on the gas works
interviewerdoing maintenance or just just
speakerAhe used to be on the boilers
interviewer(()) oh I see
speakerA((and he used to)) on the boilers and eh he used to tell us then it were very hard times there was no (()) coal no coal no nothing and he used to say to us when we're drawin' the fire tomorrow mornin' at eh s- half past six so of course a crowd of us neighbours and my sister and I we used to go
speakerBy- +you you're goin' all wrong
speakerA(()) and then we used to go and pick these 'ot cinders and we used to go when they drew the damp the furnace out then eh we used to go and pick these cinders in the bags and put them on these little carriages or trolleys and used to wheel them 'ome ((where we)) always had a fire and then they opened a soup kitchen in St. James' school
interviewerhow old would you be then do you reckon
speakerAI'd be about eleven and then we used to take a big jug in the mornin' and used to get a jug of porridge to give 'em before went to school then when we came home we used to ((keep)) a big jug and go back for soup for our dinners every day we done that that was they'd give us that you see
interviewerdid you have to have a special letter to go or could you just could anybody go
speakerAall d- all school (()) all Hindpool yes all Hindpool different you see different ehm wards had different soup kitchens opened and of course two pound was a lot then for a man's money you know
interviewerhow much do you reckon your father would earn
speakerAwell about eh one pound fifteen to two pound a week
interviewerit wasn't so much though was it
speakerAno and then of course eh mother ((were)) havin' eh we used to come home from school and mother used to give us these little bits of linen to be sewin' and we always used to sit and sew these at night and we used to sit say to her what are these mum we mummy we use eh ((we're)) sewin' she used to say oh they're only tea towels and then ((we were)) I us- +used used to say to her what a lot o' tea towels you got mum little did I know that we was makin' napkins for the baby that was comin'
interviewerand she never told you
speakerAnever told us a word we knew nothing then we was innocent as the ((grave)) then but they know it goin' to school we knew nothing
interviewerbut didn't you I mean when the baby actually came did she send you all away or what
speakerAno when the baby were born we could hear ehm I used to we used to know how fat mum was gettin' but we didn't know anything and then eh eh I heard eh a noise one night and I got up and I thought (()) me mama must be ((bad and)) I went in the room and I said is me mama bad and eh me dad he said no go and get you back into bed me lass he said she'll be alright come mornin' and when I got up in the mornin' I went in she'd had this little baby and it was stillborn so I said eh she said eh you're not going to school today {NS} and I said aren't I and ((she said)) no you'll have to stay at home ((she says)) I want you to do something for me so I said what's been the matter with you mum and she said well I've had a baby eh I've got a baby so I said where is it so she said it's just there it was on a washstand in those days ((it)) was on a pillow and a cover over it and when I looked at it it was like a little doll s- +small very small and she says I want you to go she says to eh a shop and ask for a soapbox and I said a soapbox mum and she said yes I said what's it for she's to put this that baby in so I brought this soapbox back and I called on the road to my friend a young girl I went with so I told her and she went with me she's oh I'll come down to your house with you so she came and you we had a look at this little doll and then eh my friend said let us line this little box with a bit of waddin' so we lined this box with this bit of waddin' and then me mama put this wee baby in this box and the lids fastened down like the boxes do today no nails and eh I said well we c- +can I know she said and there's a letter here they didn't call them midwives then they were just ladies and ((it)) used to be half a crown or five shillin' to come and deliver a baby and eh she give (()) letter she now you've got to go up the cemetery and give this letter she's to the grave digger ((any)) grave digger you see in so I said well we can't take it wrapped up in paper so I went in the back and I saw an old coat of me dad's and I ripped the black linin' out of this coat and we wrapped this little box in this linin' and put some string round it and put under our arms and off we went to the grave digger and eh give him this letter and he read it he said oh yes he said just take it over in the church eh church porch there he says love he said you'll see a few parcels in that corner he says just leave it there me bein' inquisitive I said what are you gonna do with it 'e said oh well you see we have public graves everybody don't buy graves he said they haven't the money he said so when the public graves get nearly built fill up he said we put one in each grave oh I said that's what you do is it he said yes so ((he'd had the letter)) 'e said eh tell your mummy it'll be alright and we turned back 'ome
interviewerdid it upset you at the time
speakerAyes because we thought it was like a little doll and you see it wasn't really you know eh dev- +developed eh just small
interviewerand how old would you be then
speakerAI'd be about twelve
interviewerdear that's awfully sad isn't it
speakerAmh
interviewerhow did she lose any more besides that one
speakerAyes she 'ad two or three misses after that but ehm they (()) nothing you see
interviewershe you di- +did she didn't have any who actually were born and died later on
speakerAyes she had one that was born and eh it ehm be about two or three month older and I remember that dyin' and when they live or breathe you have to have a little coffin for them and this one breathed and eh it would be about a week old and then it died and I remember this little coffin and eh she had one coach 'orse no motors then and eh four women had to come as a bearer two each side and they put this little coffin across there and mother had to buy them a six penny (()) pair o' white gloves each and they took them back to the cemetery you see that was buried and that would be buried in a public grave of course
interviewerso she she really lost what f- f- four maybe all together
speakerAoh yes mother (()) had a quite (()) she lost eh they buried that one and then she had that ehm miss that I took up and that had never breathed but it was formed but the others were
interviewerjust early on yes when she actually had them that were sort of you know full term did she have the woman come in to look after her
speakerA((she had to)) father used to go and bring this lady and eh they used to come every mornin' just to wash it that was all and then I had to stay at home and eh look after the others and look after me dad and look after eh and then I used to take ehm the old fashioned wash basins up from the old slab and some hot water and she used to ((sit up)) in bed and wash the napkins out and give ((them me)) and I used to peg them out on the line
interviewerwere they I supposed these midwives were qualified were they
speakerAoh no just an ordinary woman with a white apron on that was all there was no didn't call them nurses you called 'em Mrs
interviewerdid she ever have the doctor
speakerAno no didn't know what doctors was then
interviewerdear
speakerAno never 'ad no doctors I remember o- +one one of them eh was bein' born I don't know which one it was and she was washin' at the dolly tub and the dolly legs goin' and she took bad there and went to bed and in half an hour's time she had this baby
interviewergood heavens they must have been very tough in those days
speakerAthey were tough she used to go out to wash at Piel island when the war was on and she had a permit she couldn't go across to Piel island without this permit and she used to go out and do a day's washin' for half a crown she used to leave us (()) at nine o'clock and go to Piel island and she couldn't get over without a pass
interviewerand do some washing
speakerAyeah
interviewerdid she do any other work outside the house
speakerAyes she took washin' in took washin' in 'alf a crown a dozen
interviewera dozen anything
speakerAironin' and everything all in didn't matter whether big curtains or anything she done and she'd
interviewerwhere did she dry all this washing
speakerAaround the fire round the fire or else outside if it was nice
interviewerand where were you living at this time
speakerA((oh)) livin' in eh Exmouth street then and mother went (()) ((took out))
interviewerso you really there must have been washing around all the time
speakerAoh always mh
intervieweryou know with the family washing as well
speakerAyou tellîn' me with all the baby clothes (())
interviewerdid she did she make all the things for the babies all the clothes
speakerAwell they were very cheap in those days you see our shoes were only two and eleven pence ((hapenny)) a pair and six and ((hapenny)) a pair of stockin's they weren't very dear (()) you see
interviewerbut did she do much sewing
speakerAoh she made all our frocks yes and eh frocks that we used to ha- +have they used to be leg o' mutton sleeves big she used to call them leg o' mutton sleeves they make all our frocks no machine
interviewergood heavens
speakerAall by 'er 'and she never knew what a machine was
interviewergood heavens what had she done before she was married
speakerAoh well she had a shop she was the only child and she was born in Dudley and she ehm father was born in Dudley and ((were)) married in Dudley and mother was the only child and they had a shop 'er mother died and her grandmother took her you see and she had this shop with 'er grandmother and then mother got married and the ((grandma)) died and the shop was broke up and then father came to Barrow see for a job brought me with 'im of course of course mother had eh f- +few eh one or two then and eh I came to Barrow with me dad and we got lodgin's in Anson street and then me dad got a job and then he sent for mother and the children and that's how we come to Barrow
interviewera lot of people came from eh Staffordshire to Hindpool didn't they (()) iron works
speakerAyes yes they were all Staffordshire nearly all Hindpool was Staffordshire people and then of course there was the eh coronation we used to dress the street up you know
interviewertell me about that
speakerAwell we eh when the eh king died and then the eh prince of Wales was going to take over the throne we started to dress the eh street up we used to run eh pea and pie supper in one body's house and a hot pot supper in another woman's house to get this money we used to charge about two shillin' and we used to gather this money and then we used to send away to the factory for eh the flag with eh the prince of Wales on and buntin's yards and yards of material and {NS} used to sit and sew all these buntin's
interviewerwhich coronation was this by the way which coronation was this
speakerBthis you're talkin' about George the fifth
speakerAGeorge the f- +fifth George the fifth
interviewer(()) nineteen eleven about yes before the first world war
speakerB((that's what she's talking about))
speakerAbefore the first world war yes
intervieweryeah that's fine yes that's fine
speakerAmh and then eh we used to eh
speakerBbut I only remember decorating the street so
speakerAyes
speakerBwhen the late king died
speakerAyes
speakerBthe grandfather of the queen now
speakerAmh and then eh we used eh thread all these eh buntin's from bedroom to bedroom you see and then eh {NS} used to lend us those big lights and eh we had the lights on then we got ehm electric ehm what you put in the street didn't we to eh switch on we gave eh the oldest lady switch the lights on when eh (()) it was eh when we was goin' to be crown and
interviewerdid you have a tea party
speakerAoh full yes all the lot in the full street with tressels out with bands out with dancin' out at night and we had all the men used to make trelli- +trellis trellis work round the doors and we used to go in one another's houses and make paper flowers we made 'undreds and 'undreds of paper flowers we used to then we went up the woods and gathered green green leaves and then we used to decorate all this archway every door had archway and every door had ((them)) little fairy lights on and then they were switched on at night
interviewerthat was very nice
speakerAand then they eh they didn't get the five shillin' then did they no they no- +not
speakerB((what five shillin'))
speakerAthey ((oh no)) that was in the street (()) they got a five shillin' piece what did they get that one for ((they get then aunt)) {NS} got one then (()) what that was but in eh 'indpool it and then well I remember princess Louise comin' down the street in open sh- eh landau she came down eh eh it's going back
speakerBthat was in house street that was house street (())
speakerAand they came down house street
speakerBand they weren't electric lights they were all little candles
speakerA((I didn't))
speakerBall round the archways then
speakerAwas it little candles I thought that we (())
speakerBthe first time the second time we had the electric
speakerAmh
speakerBbut they were all little candles
speakerAthe first time
speakerBthe first time
speakerAmh
interviewerdid did y- +you did anything happen when queen Victoria died
speakerAwell when queen Victoria died eh I remember nothing 'cause I was on ironworks road and I know me mum took ehm {NS} me sister and eh my brother and my father and then they went up come up to the town and I had to stay at home to be on the ground nobody had to leave the works you see they had always somebody to man the works because the there's always somebody comin' you see in the office but they came up when the old queen Victoria died but I didn't see anything of that no
interviewerhow many different houses did you live in in Hindpool
speakerAone
interviewerjust one in house street
speakerAtill we lost it
speakerBno Exmouth street love
intervieweroh I see
speakerBExmouth street
speakerAExmouth street till it was bombed eh till it went down
intervieweroh I see I see
speakerAand then we came down here
interviewerwhat was the house like in Exmouth street when you went into it can you remember
speakerBjust something similar to this
speakerAsummit it
speakerBsummit like this
speakerAsummit like this er eh two bedrooms three bedrooms wasn't it three bedrooms and a parlour and a kitchen and a hall and back yard and that just like this
interviewercan you remember what kind of furniture your mum had
speakerAeh yes she had ehm a bedroom suite with side ((reflectors)) on not like they are today you could open them whichever way you wanted and a washstand the old fashioned wash basins and the soap dishes and the one for the tooth what is it and ehm a dresser with a big glass in it big mirror in and big vases on very big vases black chandeliers
interviewerwhat did you use sorry
speakerAand eh
interviewergo on (())
speakerAand the old sofa it wasn't a couch they call- +called they called 't a sofa ((an old)) sofa and eh arm chairs and the old fashioned rockin' chair like wicker
interviewerwhat did you use the parlour for
speakerAeh well the parlour we used to go and play in it mother let us go and play in at night sit in (()) makin' doll clothes and that we used to (()) go and get about three ((wo- +worth)) three penny worth of patchworks from the shop and we used to sit makin' little doll clothes with a peg we used to thought it was no wonderful if we got a doll ((more than threpenny in a bazaar)) in those days and at Christmas time we just had a orange and apple and a few nuts and a new penny piece and a few sweets and we used to think we were well off
interviewerdid you have any Easter eggs at Easter
speakerAoh yes mother used to buy us a little Easter egg they were only a few coppers then but mother always dyed us them and laid them all on the top of the window ((there)) everybody had them on the window ledge in those days used to dye them different colours and put them along the top of the window and then we used to go to Walney or Furness Abbey and roll them down and whoever cracked it 'ad it
interviewerwhat sort of things did you have to eat when you were a little girl what would you have for your breakfast
speakerAwell we eh used to have eh porridge and eh a bit o- +of toast and a bit o- +of jam that was all eh mother used to make us a pan o- +off soup ((or)) eh used to go then and used to get 'alf a pound of stewin' steak for about threepence hapenny and I used to pay a penny for (()) get a bone marrow bone a penny and she used to boil it and boil it and till she got all the stock and then she used to make a soup
interviewerdid she put vegetables in it
speakerA((there were)) all vegetables we used to go for the at two penny with the pot herbs we used to get one leek one carrot and there were bit of turnip and a parsnip and piece of cabbage for threepence that was the pot herbs
interviewerand how long would that last you all just the
speakerAone
interviewerjust the day I suppose
speakerAjust the day for all of us yes
interviewerwhat else would you have for your dinners
speakerAwell some eh sausage and mash and eh another day she would have eh fish and parsley sauce and some mashed potatoes and she used to boil the rice a pan o- +of rice she used to was no tin rice she used to bake a pan o- +of rice and we never had no no milk we didn't know what no milk was the babies had Nestle's they were brought up on Nestle's milk for the bottle and we had the tin milk I can remember it used to call it calf brand milk and she used to put three spoon full of some milk in boilin' water and mix that up with the rice and we used to have that with the rice
interviewer((pudding))
speakerAafter our dinner but not in the cooker or in the pan ((on the top))
interviewerdid you ever have rabbit
speakerAoh yes we have ehm father had a lot o- +of rabbits used to go rabbitin'
interviewerhow did he catch them
speakerA'e had a ferret dad had a ferret and then mother used to clean them skin them and that and clean them and then she used to eh stuff inside it and she used to get a needle and cotton and sew it all up inside and then she used to put it in the cooker
interviewerhow often would he go ferreting once a week or less than that
speakerAoh just when he went felt like it then she would go to the market and she would ehm get a sheep's head or a pi- +pig pig's head and she used to cut the chawl off
interviewerthat was the cheek is it
speakerAthe cheek and she used to roa- +roast roast them then she used to cut all the snuffle out and then eh she used to soak it in salt water and she used to make boil that and then she used to make brawn of that when it was done she used to thread it all an' make brawn and
interviewershe'd press it did she
speakerApress it she used to put it in a basin and she used to put a two pound weight on you know a weight that the not the weight they have today and she used to put a two pound weight on 'cause there was no fr- +fridge no fridges in those days ((and then)) she used to press and she used to put it on the cold stone floor then it used to turn out used to cut it ((and that she used)) to make our sandwiches and then for father she used to say well you better go and (()) eh when you comin' home from school call and get her a pair o- +of kippers at at three hapence a pair or a penny bloater
interviewerthat was for his tea was it
speakerAthat was for dad's tea and we used to have an egg
intervieweryou children had an egg
speakerAyes and one would have the top of me dad's today and she'd have the top of it another day we used to ((suck))the top
interviewerthat was y- +your that was tea time
speakerAtea time
interviewerwhen would you have the brawn was that a tea time dish as well
speakerAthat was just a sandwich only a sandwich not a knife and fork
interviewerno ((only)) a sandwich
speakerAjust a sandwich
interviewerfor tea time
speakerAmh yeah and then perhaps tomorrow we'd have jam sandwich that was all
interviewerdid your father ever go fishing
speakerAno never went fishin' no
interviewerdid you ever go collecting shellfish from the channel
speakerAwent to the f- we used to go over eh to the Walney and there was no bridge then there were the rowin' boats used to row hapenny over and hapenny back and we used to go penny winklin' used to pick all these penny winkles and mother used to eh salt them and soak them and salt them and then she used to boil us them and we used to sit on the step and pick them all out we used to have a round o- +of bread and that used to be enj- +enjoy we used to enjoy that
interviewerdo you remember any people in Hindpool having typhoid
speakerAtyphoid fever no I don't think I remember that no
interviewereh there there was quite a lot about (()) ehm
speakerAyes
interviewereh used to be thought they got it from the shellfish that's why I was asking
speakerAno no I never 'eared of it no
interviewerno how often would you go winkling
speakerAoh eh when we was always eh broke up from the school we used to go every day we used to take a bottle o- +of cold tea and four or five eh jam sandwiches mother used to pack us ((them up)) in bags and off we used to go to ferry field we used to be there all day and then we used to pay hapenny and go over and then we used to come back with a basket o- +of winkles and that used to be our 'oliday (())
interviewerhow many of you would go I mean was it just your brothers and sisters or friends ((as well))
speakerAoh no (()) half the street used to go then we used to go to Ramside we used to walk down the lines then right from here t- walk down the lines to Ramside
interviewerthe great lot of you
speakerAyeah crowd of us enjoyin' it we used to enjoy ourselves and if we got threepence a week pocket money we were well off get a hapenny orange or or hapenny hapen- +hapenny (()) tiger nuts or a hapenny apple or (()) dolly mixtures used to get those little sweets with eh heart sweet I love you you're my lover I lo- +love and I'm your sweetheart writ on these little sweets they were better days then than they are today I'll tell you
interviewerI know
speakerAand we used to enjoy ourselves with m- threepence more than they ((do now)) with thirty pound
speakerBtell 'er about the king of the deep the king of the deep
speakerAwhat was that
speakerBthe crabs
speakerAoh yes we used eh there used to be a gentleman you k- +king the king of the deep he used to go crabbin' and he used to bring us these crabs and we used to mother used to boil these crabs for ((us))
speakerB((take it)) enamel wash up dish outside and he'd give it you full for a shillin'
speakerAwash up
interviewergood heavens
speakerAmh crabs
interviewerand you used to boil 'em
speakerAboil them yes yes
speakerBeverybody in the street used to buy them
speakerAmh and then we used to pull the claws off and and get a mother used to give us 'air pin and she used to wash it the 'air pin used to pick them these claws (()) and a a round o- +of bread we used to enjoy it
interviewerwas a good tea
speakerAyes and what do they think of it today nothing
speakerBtoo much ((trouble for them))
interviewerdo you remember people keeping pigs in Hindpool
speakerAyes we kept pigs
interviewerdid you
speakerAmy mother kept pigs yeah yeah
interviewerdo tell me about it
speakerAdown piggy lane where this k-
speakerBthey didn't call it piggy lane then
speakerAno they
speakerBthey didn't call it piggy lane
speakerA(()) piggy lane
speakerBthere was a lot of allotments
speakerAyes they were all allotments and the eh eh used to let them off and they used to let them off in pigstys and there used to be a woman there she used to carry a bucket on 'er head
speakerB(()) I always remember that woman
speakerAand she had like of ehm something like this
speakerB(()) thing on top of her head
speakerA((she'd)) to put it on the top of her 'ead small and she would put the bucket on that and sh- +she
speakerBkeep it stop there stop there ((stop it))
speakerAbut this bucket this bucket of pig stuff
speakerB(())
speakerAalways never carried it nowhere only on 'er 'ead and eh mh mother mother bought a little the eh she had some little pigs and mother bought a little pig off two little pigs off 'er they were very cheap you know thirty shillin' you know and mother used to go down of a mornin' and I used to go down with them with the pigs well used to whatever were left and bread and we used to boil all the potatoe peelin's and the cabbage peelin's everything went in eh for the pigs and then when it got eh big we had them slaughtered (()) and then eh that kept mother for a week or two
interviewerwho slaughtered them for you
speakerAyou'd take 'em to slaughter'ouse
interviewerand they did them there
speakerAthey done them for you mh
interviewerthen you brought them back again
speakerAyes and they used to cut them up for you and bring them back
interviewerand when you when she when they cut them up what did she do with them then
speakerAwell she use- +used they were only small as a (()) suckin' pig eh she used to eh when you used to do ((them near you)) for Christmas we used to do the loin and the leg in one piece she went away every Christmas or in the summer and eh they always took a little suckin' pig with them didn't they as a gift to the Staffordshire people you see that used to keep them ((she)) always took a little suckin' pig with (('er))
interviewerthis is the neighbour
speakerAyes 'course in those days they used to l- put the little suckin' pigs in the window in the butcher's window with an orange in their mouth just lay it for Lent you see not chopped up or anything well then when we got bigger eh dad used to go and buy a suckin' pig for us for Christmas we never had eh a joint we always had a suckin' pig and mother used to do the loin and the leg and all the family when we were married we all went to dinner you see
interviewerhow lovely yes was it mostly the ladies who had the pigs not the men
speakerAmostly the ladies the men the men never bothered used to go and clean them out and everything
interviewerand you all helped the children helped
speakerAwell I don't know what'll eh the others (()) I used to just help mother you know we'd only two little wee ones they didn't make much you just eh got a bit of grass you know for beddin' ((with a little))
interviewerdid she ever grow any vegetable did she ever have an allotment for vegetables
speakerAno there was no garden at all no we could go to the gardens of a Sunday mornin' at the allotment and get a penneth of rhubarb eh and eh twopenny o- +of lettuce or anything like that buy them from the gardens me dad 'ad a garden a bit when we come up in Exmouth street he'd a small little allotment he used to go down and grow a little bit more like for the kitchen garden that was all didn't have a big garden or flowers ((or anything like that))
interviewerno but he grew vegetables
speakerAjust a few vegetables (()) f- +few few potatoes and a few carrots and
interviewerbut it all helped didn't it
speakerAand lettuce 't all 'elped all 'elped the 'ouse yes
interviewerbut your mother only had just the one lot of pigs and that was all
speakerAthat was all the two little suckin' pigs and she had enough to do at home without feedin' suckin' pigs
interviewerI bet she did I bet she did yes yes indeed
speakerAmh
interviewerand what did your parents do if they had any spare time I don't suppose they had so much
speakerA((the)) well eh mother used to eh go to these jumble sales and she used to buy a lot of coats and she used to bring them 'ome and she used to cut these coats all in pieces all all out and she used to wash them and after she washed them and dried them we used to have to cut them up in pieces and she 'ad buy used to buy two sugar bags and join the sugar bags together and dad made us some podgers wooden podgers and we used to cut these strips of these old eh coats and mother used to tell us which colour to design and we made the rugs never bought a rug we used to make them and we used to podge them every night that was what we used to do
interviewerdid she ever make patchwork quilts
speakerAoh plenty mh yes
interviewerwas another way of makin' ends meet wasn't it
speakerAyes
interviewer(())
speakerA(()) was all patchwork was not eh eiderdowns and eh frills and flounces as there is today
interviewerall patchwork
speakerAyeah yes
interviewerdid she make anything else for the house
speakerAeh no (()) make the rugs she used to sit and make patchwork quilts she used to s- make our frocks
speakerBshe baked her own bread
speakerAshe made 'er own bread always baked a batch o- +of bread two or three batches
speakerB(())
speakerAshe make 'er own bread and we used to take it to the bakehouse used to make it and then eh used to go to the bakehouse and get the tins they used to lend you the tins and then we used to take it on the ((mangle)) board used to on the old fashioned mangle board and then eh used to go for it about four o'clock when it come out the oven hapenny a loaf well a batch of bread went nowhere with us lot you know mother was always bakin'
interviewerhow much would she do at a time
speakerA'alf a stone
speakerB((half)) a stone
interviewerso it'd be almost every day she was baking
speakerA'half a stone of flour and twopenneth o- +of barm an' a drop of ehm water and a pinch o- +of s- +salt a handful o- +of salt and make own bread
interviewerand how how often do you think she would do it in a week
speakerAoh three times a d- +day
speakerBthree times
speakerAthree times a week a batch o- +of bread mh ((we've had))
interviewerthat would take some work as well
speakerAyeah if when we ((was runnin')) short o- +of bread and we u- +used I used to g- +go 'ave to go for a loaf into duke street here where the co-op is now Corkills they used to weigh it used to pay and if it wasn't a two pound loaf it was twopence hapenny a loaf then they used to cut up tea cake into 'em put a piece on to make the weight 'course whoever went for this loaf enjoyed that bit of tea cake comin' 'ome mother never got the eh overweight we had the overweight
interviewerI think that was your reward anyhow
speakerAused to enjoy that oh I'll go for the bread today mum if you don- +don't if you she wouldn't cut the bread when it come out the bakehouse 't was too hot you (()) it couldn- +couldn't wouldn't go nowhere cuttin' it you know
interviewershe liked to cut it thin did she
speakerAno no it it was very 'ard to cut you know when it was hot it could flop see and a day old it got a bit staler well mother used to 'ave that all they had for their suppers was a round of 'ome made bread and a bit o- +of cheese that was all mother and dad had
interviewerdoes did you ever have any supper or was it just something the grown ups had
speakerAoh we just had a piece o- +of bread (()) what there was there was no fish and chips and no eh nothing like there is today yeah
interviewerdid you ever had any fruit apart from Christmas time
speakerAno mother couldn't afford it ((there be)) (()) she used to give us a penny or twopence to go to the pictures ((well we)) used to buy hapenny apple or hapenny orange or (()) o- +of sweets we were 'appy
interviewerdid you ever collect anything from the countryside like firewood or blackberries or mushrooms or anything like that
speakerAwe used to go blackberryin' at times didn't we
speakerB(()) in your younger days (()) I don't know ((about what you did))
speakerAwe went ehm used to go ((along)) the road blackberryin' eh but we never used to get many because it was such a walk you know from the place
interviewerwhat about firewood
speakerAwell
speakerBnah I think (()) plenty
speakerAwe never never went firewood no we never went pickin' firewood no
interviewerhow was your house lit when you were a little girl
speakerAeh gas no electric didn't know what that was and a candle on the candle stick to go to bed mh blow it out as soon as you get into bed don't forget
interviewerwere candles expensive
speakerAno they were about eh (()) 'alf a dozen for threepence very cheap was candles and the matches was hapenny a box
interviewersome
speakerAand I used to go for a penny packet o- +of tea if I run short for tea I could run out for a penny a packet o- +of tea (()) can't do it today (())
interviewerwhere did your mother get her things from her her food mo- +mostly was it was it mostly local shops
speakerAeh no we u- +used
interviewerwould she go into town
speakerAgo into town ((used)) to go to town and bring a back enough back for the week you see
interviewerso it was only (())
speakerAbut when we come up into Hindpool and eh we weren't run short we'd only got to go into bath street the top o- +of bath street around the corner you see
interviewerwhen times were bad would the shops give you credit
speakerAno not as I know ((on)) no
interviewerno
speakerAeh mother wouldn't have the money to pay ((the time)) she paid her rent she wouldn't have enough so she just had to buy what she could and make what she could
interviewerwhat would the rents be do you know
speakerAabout five shillin' or six shillin' a week that was all and coal was a shillin' a bag we used to cou- +could cou- +could go we could go (()) with a bucket and go for threepenny worth o- +of coal or we could ((if we went)) for 'alf hundred weight or a quarter the coal h- +house mh coal 'ouse where we went for used to lend us a barrow and we used to fetch it up in the barrow mother used to empty it in the back yard and then we used take the barrow back but we often used to go for threepenny ((worth)) in a bucket (('t was)) only a shillin' a ((bag)) then
intervieweryes how many bags a week would she need
speakerAwell (()) about two course eh it wasn't a fire like this you see and it was 'igh and with (())
interviewera range
speakerArange yes and on the side of the range was eh little rings and we used to fill that with water and the heat of that used to run the water and then there was a tap there and when we washed up we used to go ((with)) a lading can and get a a lading can of 'ot water from there and bring a lading can of cold water back and put it back in there that's 'ow we got the 'ot water
interviewerhow would you manage for baths
speakerAthey used to do that with the bath
interviewerand then eh di- +did was she fussy about having you know the girls and the boys separately for baths
speakerAoh yes oh yes
interviewer'cause it must have been quite a problem you know when there wasn't a bathroom
speakerAno we had no bathroom but the boys used to go one night or as different nights and the girls used to go different nights (()) we used to always have Saturday night used to have we ((picked)) Saturday night mother used to bath us and do our 'air plat all our 'airs and she used to go for a penny worth o- +of beer and she used to comb it with this beer and it used to frizz it all up for us ((we'd)) long 'air long ginger 'air
interviewerall of you how nice yes that was for Sunday was it
speakerA((ev- +every)) {NS} was ((gin- +ginger)) ((or is it)) just turnin' now
speakerB((mine is gone)) (())
speakerAshe was ginger you see we all were ginger and ((they've all gone))
interviewerdid your father do anything about the house
speakerAoh yes he used to bring the coal in and eh he used to light the fire and eh dad used to see to the boys and mother saw to the girls and eh dad always saw to the boys if they were out 'e was after them and when we got old and we were out eh mother used to tell us be in to certain time if we weren't in at ten o'clock they were at the corner dad used to be at the corner where 'ave you been who 'ave you been with I told you to be in at ten and where are they now they don't come in at all
interviewerno no were they strict do you think your parents
speakerAeh yes they were very strict eh but eh I think we had a good time and nothing it done us it's done no 'arm to us and we didn't know anything they never told us anything what eh certain ages we had to tell our sisters
intervieweroh I see
speakerAyou understand
interviewerI've often wondere how you found out was your sister
speakerAI 'ad to tell you and you would have to tell 'er
interviewerthe next one down yes often wonder how the oldest one found out
speakerAmother used to have a bag ((don't recall)) mother used to have a bag on the
interviewerno
speakerAthere (()) used to be brass eh bedsteads and mother 'ad a a bag a school bag and and we used to have to put them in there
interviewerah
speakerAand then when we come 'ome we used to have to wash them ourselves but they weren't what they buy today
interviewerno it was cloth
speakerAmother made they were bits o- +of calico and mother used to put a little bit of tape there and a bit o- +of tape there and we used to have ((the)) tape ((on))
interviewerI see
speakerAthat's how we found out we was as innocent as the
speakerB((grate))
interviewer((well)) it didn't seem to do any harm at all ((did it))
speakerAno no 'arm at all
interviewerno no
speakerAwent to farm service we used to walk from here to Ulverston
interviewerdid you
speakerAused to wait for the gov- eleven o'clock till they s- +started eh started used to ring the bell the old farmers and used to come up king street and used to say is thee for 'irin' lass and used to say aye and eh you'd say what are you (()) ((he would say)) well what's thee askin' and we used to say well what are you gonna give us I'll give thee ((full)) four pound ten and you'd say no thank you no thank you and we used to walk on a bit farther down king street and another farmer would come up and say is thee for 'irin' lass perhaps we'd get five pound ten off him for the six month and used to say can you wash and can you bake and can you scrub and used to have to go out and look for stones different sand stones we used to have to chop all these sandstones fine and eh that used to eh like eh gravel to eh the stone floor rub it all round
interviewer((to rub the floor))
speakerAto rub the stone floor
interviewergood heavens
speakerAinstead of a scrubbin' brush used to sprintle it on and scour it
interviewerwith a cloth
speakerAwith a cloth
interviewerhow old were you when you first went to the hiring fairs
speakerAeh thirteen and I told my mother I was goin' to the 'irin' fair and ((she's)) you can't she said ((you haven't)) you're not (()) fourteen I said tell the teacher I've gone to me grandmother's and she told 'er I'd gone to me grandmother's me and me friend went ((told for)) the both of us
interviewerand where did you go to the fa- +farm where was the farm you went to
speakerALongbridge in Preston that's eh
interviewerthat was a long way from home wasn't it
speakerAyeah yeah
interviewerwere you homesick at all
speakerAwe used to feel it but what was the good then I went to Newland Bottom corn mill at Ulverston and my father used to come every Sunday it was very hard times then it was the Durham strike was on then and 'e used to come and 'e used to ask the old farmer if he could eh sub a pound off {NS} money and eh as they hadn't anything and he used to give 'im a pound probably when ehm {NS} come lent the (()) to come 'ome I'd 'ardly ((ought)) to come 'ome to
interviewerthey paid you at the end of your six months did they
speakerAyes at the end of the six month
interviewerand were you doing domestic work at at Newland's as well as at Longbridge
speakerAno I left there (())
intervieweryeah
speakerAtwo 'alf year eh 'alf a year there and 'alf a year that
intervieweryes it was still domestic work was it
speakerAyeah oh yes then ehm I have to tell you this bit and then one on the Christmas I was at ehm Longbridge I'm eh Christmas day come and I was a bit homesick you know and eh (('ad)) our Christmas day's dinner so (()) I washed up and all that and she said eh is it finished now and I said eh yes madam so she said well if thou'll get all that paper there I says you'll see a lot o- +of paper there I said and there's a big needle there there's a ball o- +of string I says if ((thou)) go down to paddock that was the toilet what was in this paddock (()) long way out and she ((says)) and sit there you can take scissors she said and cut some paper up she says and thread it she says for the lavatory and I sat there all Christmas day and I think I cried ((nearly)) a bucket full o- +of tears
intervieweroh no surprise
speakerAChristmas afternoon and I was sit
speakerB((I don't know)) you've made us laugh I don't know about (())
interviewerI think it's sad
speakerAsittin' cuttin' bits o- +of paper
speakerBoh dear
speakerAbits o- +of paper like that and gettin' this big needle and spreadin' them and tyin' knots in and tyin' on these hooks till about 'alf past four and I went in for me tead sitting there on the lavatory seat
interviewerwas the work very hard
speakerAvery 'ard
interviewerwhat time would they get you up in the morning
speakerAeh five o'clock and if it was a nice day a nice night we used to lead the hay till we couldn't see used to make hay while the sun shine p'raps tomorrow it'd be wet well we didn't go out o- +of doors then we worked inside doors but if it was nice tomorrow we were up by the light of the day out in the 'ay field turnin' it over and sh- +shaking cockin' it up and shakin' it up and all that then eh used to go back and used to take the food to the eh labourers the lads the 'ay makers and that ((they)) were nice I enjoyed it and then eh I'd 'ad enough then of farm service so I was fourteen (()) about fifteen I came 'ome and I had no job so there was piece in the paper wanted a a young l- +lady a young girl to learn as a cook it was the criterion in Cornwallis street so mother said eh there's a place here she said I think it'd be do alright for you and I said oh I don't (()) to go mum and she well if you don't ((go there)) you'll go back to farm service oh I said I ((don't want)) to go back to farm service so I went the criterion and I served me time as a cook there but eh I used to cry every mornin' eh goin' because I had to start at the bottom just with the pans and and potatoes I 'ad to start at the very bottom and then I had to work meself up you see and then eh I used to get fifteen shillin' a week for that and then mother used to eh I never used to get me m- wages till about nine o'clock on a Saturday night or nine o'- +o'clock when we finished they used to eh 'ave the footballers come in for a a meal the Barrow footballers and I used to take a bobbin o- +of cotton with me and when I got me pay bag I used to put this cotton round me pay bag and it was f- three story 'igh and I used to drop it down with this reel o- +of cotton till me mother got it and then she'd tear it off and off she used to go in the Barrow market and the bell used to go at nine o'clock when that bell went they used to auction the meat and auction all the fruit everything was auctioned she used to get enough meat to last 'er for a week for 'alf a crown and then she used to get us all our fruit then perhaps fifty bananas for a shillin' or cup a dozen oranges for a shillin' and bags of apples
interviewerwould she had to have your money ((to do this))
speakerAoh yes I'd to she used to wait for me fifteen shillin' comin' down
interviewerwhere else did you work in farm service as part from Preston
speakerAthat's all
interviewerjust Preston
speakerAmh I'd 'ad enough
intervieweryes and how much did they give you eventually
speakerAfour pound ten
interviewerfor half a y- +year year
speakerAfor 'alf a year
interviewerand your keep
speakerAand your keep yeah
interviewerdid they give you any clothes
speakerAoh no no used to give you a coarse eh you'd have to take coarse eh always had a coarse apron on didn't have a pinnafore or anything like that always a coarse apron mh
interviewerwhat did you have to wear on your feet
speakerAa pair o- +of clogs
interviewerwere the best thing I should think in a farm
speakerAit was and you were a ((they used to)) think nothing of you comin' knock eh askin' you to come in the shippon if a cow was 'avin' a calf to hold the light and I think if it eh it's castor oil you used to give it in eh you know the horns you used to put the horn in its mouth and ((fill it in with)) castor oil ((it)) used to run down the down there
interviewerew you must a learned a lot (())
speakerAoh I learned a lot at farm service I learned more there than ever I learned
interviewernot surprised how long was your apprenticeship as a cook
speakerAoh I was there about two years then and then I left there and I went to the top o- +of Dalton road where there's a paper shop is today at (()) wallpaper it was the Maloury restaurant and I went there as a cook and eh my father used to get up and take me about past four because the shipyard went in at six and they had to have all the urns on because the eh men used to come in for cups o- +of tea and a bun and the night men used to be comin' off at six and the day men used to be goin' in at six so we 'ad to 'ave the urns all on and the tea made for them comin' in so I used to get up early and me dad used to bring me up 'cause it used to be dark
interviewerand what how many hours would you work I mean when did you finish
speakerAwe worked there till ((about)) eh 'alf past seven or eight at night
interviewerwhat a terrible day did you not how much time would you have off during the day
speakerAnone
interviewer((none at all))
speakerAno got ((on a)) bit o- +of dinner there ((you)) cook eh ((cook)) what there was and it's just the same as the cooks now (()) they used to come and order what there was egg and chips or 'am and egg and beef steak puddin's used to make all the beef steak puddin's in eh little cups little cups with no 'andles on used to put them in a big steamer and then as you come in and you'd say beef steak puddin' and mashed potatoes well you just tipped it up and eh your jug o- +of gravy on
interviewerhow much a week would you get ((for all that))
speakerAtwelve and six
interviewerdear me and did you work Saturdays as well
speakerAyes but not Sundays
interviewerno and no half day ((in)) the week
speakerAno no
interviewerdid you ever feel it was very unfair
speakerAno used to enjoy it used to enjoy it with this the maids the servants and the the lounge and and that no used to enjoy it and we were courtin' our chaps used to come and wait at the door for us comin' out never went ((to the)) pictures we couldn't go up the pictures or anywhere
interviewerwhere would you go
speakerAjust to walk round the town they used to call eh Dalton road monkey's parade then because everybody used to walk up and down
interviewerand I suppose that was how you met young men really
speakerAyes
interviewerif you didn't go to dances I suppose you had to meet them ((in Dalton road))
speakerAoh yes I went to the dances used to go up the dances when we finished on a Saturday night I finished there about half past eight ((if)) dances used to be open till 'alf past ten and it used to be threepence to go in on the strand used to go to dance
interviewerwhat sort of dances did they do
speakerAeh used to do the saint Bernard's and the old fashioned waltz and ehm (()) the lances and all all the old fashioned ones the military two step
interviewerdid all the girls sit on one side and the boys on the other
speakerAthat's it boys used to sit there and the girls there (()) say please can I have this dance and if you refused them well they wouldn't come again
interviewerehm did your mother and father ever go out
speakerAno
interviewertogether
speakerAno
interviewerno
speakerAno
interviewerI don't think people did in those days did they no
speakerAthey didn't no oh no
interviewernot like they do now
speakerAno by the time they got the tea over and they used to wash them and get them off get us off to bed and and eh give us eh a bite to eat and that eh bed time never used to sit up late like they do now you know
interviewerdid your mother ever go out on her own you know to mothers' meeting or anything
speakerAno no she didn't know what a meeting was she didn't know what outin' was
interviewerno it was hard but did your dad ever get out at all
speakerAyeah dad used to go he was eh secretary of some eh union that was all out twice a week ((that's all))
interviewerdear
speakerAand the boys used to go out playin' football we used to go out and play 'opscotch shuttlecock or skippin' ropes and we used to enjoy it it's all we 'ad
interviewerdid you play any games inside the house if it was you know say a wet day
speakerAer yes we'd ((ludos)) and snakes and ladders and eh dad bought us a little bought me a little dulcimer a dulcimer and 'e and 'e made made us a swing out in the yard used to go and swing we didn't know what it was to go to a tea party or anything like that
intervieweryou didn't ever have a birthday party
speakerAoh good god (()) they used to tell you it's your birthday and that was all
intervieweryou didn't have anything special at all
speakerAno
interviewerno no I'm not surprised with (()) such a big family it must have been difficult to keep all those birthdays really
speakerAand dad used to be very fond of birds canaries 'e used to sit and beg the little boxes and 'e used to eh by the wire and 'e used to eh cut them and eh make the these little bird cages used to (()) little canaries
interviewerdid you have any other pets
speakerAyes he had a monkey we'd a monkey we'd Lena she was very good was Lena she used to come and sit there and sit on your shoulder we'd a monkey we 'ad a jackdaw we'd an Alsatian we'd a saint Bernard's the lads 'ad rabbits dad 'ad a ferret
interviewernot all at one time though
speakerAbut they were really good times better times than what they are today because the children today are not satisfied if you pay five pound I went up to ((Astor's)) yesterday and there was a lady gettin' (()) they were five pound each and she got two and then and we got a six penny hapenny doll from there we thought we were in heaven of course eh in eh when {NS} was born and and {NS} was born and the other brother were born they were really better times then then what they were 'cause she can't remember those 'ard times
speakerBno we had the good times
speakerAeh
speakerBwe had the good times
speakerAyou had the good well they weren't very good but they weren't as bad
interviewerwere some of the older ones out at work when the younger ones were born
speakerB(())
interviewerwere some of the older ones at work when the young yes
speakerByes
speakerAjust just just
speakerByeah
speakerA((just)) us two
interviewerI think it makes a difference actually
speakerAoh yes mh
interviewerwas your father out of work a lot
speakerAoh he was out a long while was me dad yes I think they didn't give them money in those days when they went up the park (()) used to go and make ehm roads up to the park woods the woods road (()) or ((something)) up there and I can always remember them givin' them ehm a relieve ticket food ticket they didn't give them money fear they boozed it used to give them the tickets and they knew then that we ((would got)) the food of course
interviewerwas he always at the gas works or did he change his job
speakerAoh no I think 'e died (()) lost 'e was bad and 'e didn't change 'is job
interviewerno so so he was at the gas works yes but
speakerAall till he died yes
interviewerhe wasn't always in work when he was there
speakerAhe was always eh in works at the gas works did you remember
speakerByes I remember 'im at the gas works
speakerAyes ((it was)) the gas works they were eh that was in their time you see
interviewerbut I suppose every time there was a coal strike the gas works was out of work
speakerAwell the gas works eh they really 'ad a good stock in but still they kept goin' on for a bit you know
interviewerwhich was the union he belonged to
speakerAit wasn't a union it was ehm some sort of eh a club
intervieweroh
speakerAehm 'e was secretary for some tontine I can remember it bein' a tontine and he used to get so much back of a Christmas time in a little bag well father was eh secretary for this tontine 'e was a good scholar 'e was a good writer the same as they are they had eh best times I hadn't I was only in standard four when I left I 'ad no time at home because I 'ad to stop at home to do the work look after the children when mother was bad and if mother 'ad anythin to do ((at)) the town I 'ad to stay at home and mind them and if it was a washing day and she had a big wash I used to have to stop at home to eh to see to the babies so I didn't get much school then they did but it done me no 'arm
interviewerno
speakerAdone me no 'arm I can count and I know
interviewerdid your mum and dad both went to school did they 'cause not everybody of their age did go to school
speakerAmum and dad well I wouldn't remember that in Staffordshire you see
interviewerno (()) they could read and well obviously your father could read
speakerB(())
speakerAoh my father was a good scholar mother was a good scholar yes mother was a good scholar mh mother was a good singer and all she was a lovely singer was my mother and me dad was a good scholar 'e really ((and)) a beautiful writer a really she's a lovely writer
interviewerdid there were there any books in the house do you remember ((any of them)) reading
speakerAoh no we weren't allowed a book didn't have a book daren- +daren't daren't bring one of those little penny eh mh eh mag- +magazines you know those little (()) books no ((by)) the time we'd done our 'ome work what we 'ad to do for school tomorrow and then we used to have to do this bit of sewing for mother the dish clo- +cloth the tea t- the tea towels
interviewerand they thought reading was a waste of time did they they thought reading was a waste of time
speakerAwell we hadn't got time at (()) we eh they used to take the Liverpool post once a week that was the only paper we took and eh I used to eh ((do)) the beds this week for I went to school and me other sister used to do them next week for she went to school and I used to ((do the))

End of interview.